Discussion about Automating an Economic System

[Sir Iain de Vembria]

Please use this thread to discuss options for wholly or partially automating an economic system.

Sir Iain
Knight-Councillor of The Barony of Treesia & Fabon,

Discuss micronations and read the news at the Micronational News Network

[Austi Scot]

Each person has so many hours during a week or a month, which can be used for production.



Ex: There are 168 hours in a seven day period –

56 hours are used for sleeping and eating etc. ; – leaving 112 hours –



112 hours can be used as productive hours by each person –



40 hours – working in government position (if the person has such a position)

72 hours – produces a given good in a given quantity based on the work a person is involved with or the natural resources from the land they own. This time could also be divided up between different productive activities.



If the person doesn’t have a government position then all 112 hours can be used for productive activity.



Once this determination is made the goods are automatically counted as being produced and available to the person for their economic activities. There can be changes made if a person sells their land – gets a different job – is elected to office or leaves office …



But I think this will take a resource manager to do record keeping – because people will change what they do at various times. Perhaps an asset list should be kept with the banking records so that people can’t claim to sell something they don’t have available to them.



Austi

 

austi_scot@hotmail.com

ICQ 94954489

[Scott Siskind]

Is there anyone here who can program well? And has a lot of free time?

[Ari Rahikkala]

* pops head out of temporal vortex *



It's trivial...



* fetches a few interesting C++ libraries from this plane of existence and disappears again into lower levels of reality *

Caminante no hay camino,
Se hace camino al andar.
- Antonio Machado

[Ari Rahikkala]

* opens a temporal vortex again *



* throws VBMCgi back with some assorted curses and a note of some obscure incompatibility that causes a segfault in the end of every program *



* throws some other library whose name is already forgotten back with some assorted curses and a note of some obscure incompatibility which causes the library to be impossible to compile *



* fetches a few more libraries *

Caminante no hay camino,
Se hace camino al andar.
- Antonio Machado

[Knight Magistrate]

I don't know which subcommittee this should go to, but I commend whoever came up with the Pacary Bank and Trust system--looks conveniently interesting.



www.geocities.com/sltroup/loans.html



What program was used here?

Chrysostom of Jerusalem Speaker of the House of Peoples Treasurer of the United Republic United Republic of Tymaria Doge of the Palpatines State of Machiavellia Brigadier, Tymarian Army (Reserve) MoD#783PA9229AB6I06Y Associate Justice League of Micronations Intermicronational Court of Justice Archivist League of Micronations As Kunshuhito Wa Resident of the City of Ex, Province of Ex Umbagollah As Crisostomo de la Cruz Ibarra NGS Independent Representative California 36th District Home of Loyola Marymount

[Brendig45]

Well, what programs are there that can be used for such a system, that can be used on the internet? I've heard that Perl is one...

Jeffrey Leong


Vizier of The Ministry of Trade and
Economics

Satrap of Kelestan

Sartip of the Imperial Babkhan Army

Ambassador to the LoSS


Kingdom of Babkha

[Kennendras]

Greetings,



Perl could be one...along with possibly C (or one of the other thousands of C's).  Maybe hook up a telenet thing, kinda like all those MUD's out there (the crummy text PRG games).  Or possibly a database thats on a server...run with ASP...im still learning ASP, so dont ask me any questions...plus im only 14.  If any of what i have said above is useless, disregard it.  I only know a few languages, and not sure of how it may apply.

Emperor Kennendras

Foreign Minister

Webmaster

The Realm of Tallandor




"Talk softly and carry a big stick"

"Facts are chains that bind and fetter truth, for a man can remake the world if he has no facts to cloud his mind"

[Ari Rahikkala]

* checks Chrysostom's link *



That system works with the non-back-propagating multi-layer bio-neural network, i.e. the form input is e-mailed to Pacary's public works address and probably taken care of by a human.



Brendig45:



Thanks to the simple interfaces, pretty much any programming language* can be used, although in some languages making web applications is easier and in some harder. I've been trying to get the development of some sort of a database manager (an automated banking system) started with C++ since I could really use C++ experience. However, at the moment I have a Swedish novel to read, three essays to write (one in Swedish) and two lectures to prepare, so my free time is copious enough anyway.



The original IMN bank (ask Scott about it if you're dying to know what it was like - and no, I do not have the script, at least not a working version of it, lying around) was written in PERL and, well, it was really a script and not a program. With all the features that can be put into an automated banking system (I've got a lot of ideas) I don't want to fall prey to PERL's apparent simplicity; Putting too many features in a script that does not have a clear structure (such as the original IMN bank) just makes it slow, resource consuming and hard to understand. That's another reason for using C++; a C++ program that has the structure of a script (i.e. no structure) would be so ugly that I would get internal bleeding in my head if I even tried to make one - so it's impossible for me to make one . A C++ program with the structure of a real program takes some time to make, but is easy to understand, easy to maintain and fast.



* programming language = a special code that is used to tell a computer what it should do. There are a LOT of programming languages around, all different in their structure, intended applications or command sets. For example, PERL is meant for short scripts that do some simple, general task. Because of this, PERL has several short-hand forms of different things (e.g. for some commands, the alphabet can be abbreviated as just a-z or A-Z) that are useful for use in normal human situations but don't bode well for specialized systems where more strict programming languages are used.

Caminante no hay camino,
Se hace camino al andar.
- Antonio Machado

[Ari Rahikkala]

Kennendras: Ever heard about such an advance of technology as CGI  ? You just get the input to forms in either STDIN or an environment variable (STDIN if the form method used was POST, the QUERY_STRING variable if the form method used was GET) and can parse it with the help of a free library (lots of those floating around for PERL, C, PHP2, Python, and, well, any language a sane programmer would use...). Then you do the database handling and write the answer back to the user (in STDOUT); Just add the MIME header "Content-type: text/html

" in the beginning and then it's only writing the HTML. Simple as anything.



Another idea I had was to make an email account with forwarding to an e-mail front-end of the program. That is, when an e-mail is forwarded to an executable, normally the executable is called and fed the raw mail (with headers) in STDIN. This means that you only need to strip the headers, parse the information that is needed, and pass it on to the database manager.  Add support for getting information from the program through email, and whack and boom, you've got an automated banking system for those whose only Internet connection goes through a mobile phone that supports only e-mail .



And maybe after a few years, the Great Automated Banking System (hmm... GABS... that sounds good...) will also respond to SMS messages, have an SSH and HTTP/SSL interface, voice recognition and MMI interfaces .

Caminante no hay camino,
Se hace camino al andar.
- Antonio Machado

[Kennendras]

And yes, i have heard about CGI, Common Gateway Interface, if i remember correctly.  I dont have alot of expierence with it (ie. i cant code it) but i know how to handle them and get free ones working .  So, as im obviosuly inadequate at programming with this group, i'll return to sitting in the shadows and listening.  Haha.

Emperor Kennendras

Foreign Minister

Webmaster

The Realm of Tallandor




"Talk softly and carry a big stick"

"Facts are chains that bind and fetter truth, for a man can remake the world if he has no facts to cloud his mind"

[Ari Rahikkala]

And now I scared him away :...



When I began programming the IMN bank (a loooong time ago) I didn't even know what language to write it in, and much less I knew PERL and CGI... I had to ask around just to figure out what CGI was. Since you already know more than I knew at that time, you're obviously not inadequate...

Caminante no hay camino,
Se hace camino al andar.
- Antonio Machado

[Kennendras]

Lol...dont worry, im not going to go hide in the mountains and not see human life for a century.  i just need to read up a bit more.  And, im quite proud, i just got my application script working (thank goodness) and now properly uses CGI instead of javascript email thing.  Im interested to see what you guys come up with.  

Emperor Kennendras

Foreign Minister

Webmaster

The Realm of Tallandor




"Talk softly and carry a big stick"

"Facts are chains that bind and fetter truth, for a man can remake the world if he has no facts to cloud his mind"

[Peter Little]

with the Summer Holidays in a few months, some people will have plenty of time.

Pete Little
National Affairs Minister of South Mondesia
Minister of Culture of Tymaria

[Knight Magistrate]

*About to retort about stating the obvious but holds his tongue*

Chrysostom of Jerusalem Speaker of the House of Peoples Treasurer of the United Republic United Republic of Tymaria Doge of the Palpatines State of Machiavellia Brigadier, Tymarian Army (Reserve) MoD#783PA9229AB6I06Y Associate Justice League of Micronations Intermicronational Court of Justice Archivist League of Micronations As Kunshuhito Wa Resident of the City of Ex, Province of Ex Umbagollah As Crisostomo de la Cruz Ibarra NGS Independent Representative California 36th District Home of Loyola Marymount